Vegeta Ascended Blue and Goku Kaio Ken X20
Vegeta SSj Blue Evolution [Kaio-Ken x20] 36%
Jiren [Full Power] 64%
- Vegeta learns to use the Kaio-Ken x20 while in his Super Saiyan Blue Evolution form. Can he defeat Jiren now?
Jiren. The boost provided by UI Omen outstrips this and even with that Goku couldn't win.
Jiren still shitstomps no matter how much non cannon boost you apply for Vegeta. He never had feats that he would outmatch Jiren. This can't even prove he will beat a non-full power Jiren.
Unknown, since we don't know how many times stronger Jiren is compared to Goku and Vegeta
But with 20 x the boost of Evolution Blue, I'd say he given FP Jiren a excellent fight but LB Jiren most likely still takes it
Jiren. UIO Goku was struggling with Jiren even after SSBK, and UIO gives a bigger power boost than just Kaioken.
@panzerx: I always thought ultra instinct wasn't a strength or ki booster, I thought it just made the person's resources better. Did they actually say he was stronger or was he just faster when he was using it?
@hypnos0929 said:
@panzerx: I always thought ultra instinct wasn't a strength or ki booster, I thought it just made the person's resources better. Did they actually say he was stronger or was he just faster when he was using it?
His strength apparently increased whenever he underwent the Ultra-Instinct Omen transformation. However, it doesn't seem to give Goku much higher of a power-boost than using the Genki-Dama because remember, Kefla SSj rivaled the Genki-Dama in terms of brute force, but SSj2 Kefla was even more powerful than Goku's second Ultra-Instinct Omen transformation. So this tells us that it's power-boost is somewhat greater than the Genki-Dama, which is somewhat more powerful than the Kaio-Kenx20.
Do I think that Jiren is 20x more powerful than Vegeta in his Limit-Breaker transformation? Absolutely not. Goku and Vegeta were strong enough to outlast him in the Tournament of Power in their respective transformations because neither Goku and Vegeta, or Jiren, could gain the upperhand on the opposing team until outside reinforments stepped in.
@avengersasssemb: Oh ok, so it isn't a large boost in power but it does exist
@chad_duby: duh he doesn't have the feats to beat jiren, that's why he gave him KKx20??? Essentially Kkx20+ (ssbe vegeta) with an extra multiplier of x20 added on to that; it's all hypothetical so of course it's not canon...
Ot: What the post below you says.
@doctordamn: And do you really have any concrete evidence of what will result after kaioken is applied to Vegeta? Kaioken is not just a power boost so it is nearly impossible to gauge what Vegeta will look like with that kind of power, considering we never saw him using. It is like saying what will happen if you give Alber Einstein Mjolnir. Something that is completely irrelevant towards each other.
@chad_duby: How is kk not just a power bost? Do you know something I don't??? Cause it's pretty clear that it is (Unless you are trying to say that the technique would backfire and cripple vegeta since the op didn't specify if he'd mastered it or not, otherwise...)
And, if Einstein were worthy to use mjolnir, than with the weapon, he'd be as around the level of weaponless thor. (I mean it did make a cancer patient stronger but that was obvious pis, so I wont go that far )
@doctordamn: I am arguing it could backfire. Since the Op had not stated if he would have mastered it or not so it is impossible to gauge.
There is absolutely no way to indicate what he will do with the hammer just like what will happen to Vegeta if kaioken is applied to him.
@chad_duby: ok i can respect your first point but if mjolnir made a cancer patient thor level, why wouldn't it do the same for a healthy male adult?
MUI > Jiren > UIO >> SSBx20 Spirit bomb > SSB x 20 Goku
If SSBE = SSBx20 then this Vegeta should be around the spirit bombs power but still way less than it, Jiren still stomps
@doctordamn: I meant if he is gonna use it to power himself up or just use it other way else. Thanks for respecting.
MUI > Jiren > UIO >> SSBx20 Spirit bomb > SSB x 20 Goku
If SSBE = SSBx20 then this Vegeta should be around the spirit bombs power but still way less than it, Jiren still stomps
Goku used the Kaio-Ken x20 to boost his stamina so he could continue pushing the Genki-Dama, but that doesn't suggest that it increased the power of the Genki-Dama itself.
No. Kaioken is a horrible way to fight. Goku has literally never beaten an opponent using it.
SSB evolved from a Vegeta who is not exausted would do much better.
@hypnos0929 said:
@panzerx: I always thought ultra instinct wasn't a strength or ki booster, I thought it just made the person's resources better. Did they actually say he was stronger or was he just faster when he was using it?
His strength apparently increased whenever he underwent the Ultra-Instinct Omen transformation. However, it doesn't seem to give Goku much higher of a power-boost than using the Genki-Dama because remember, Kefla SSj rivaled the Genki-Dama in terms of brute force, but SSj2 Kefla was even more powerful than Goku's second Ultra-Instinct Omen transformation. So this tells us that it's power-boost is somewhat greater than the Genki-Dama, which is somewhat more powerful than the Kaio-Kenx20.
Do I think that Jiren is 20x more powerful than Vegeta in his Limit-Breaker transformation? Absolutely not. Goku and Vegeta were strong enough to outlast him in the Tournament of Power in their respective transformations because neither Goku and Vegeta, or Jiren, could gain the upperhand on the opposing team until outside reinforments stepped in.
@avengersasssemb: Considering he still lost the pushing battle it should still count.
Just like SS1 Goku won the pushing battle with Kid Buu, SS1 gave it a boost
FP Jiren breaks a few sweats but he ultimately wins. I honestly believe SSJBE+Kaiokenx20 is too much ki control even for Vegeta to maintain for too long.
@avengersasssemb: Considering he still lost the pushing battle it should still count.
Just like SS1 Goku won the pushing battle with Kid Buu, SS1 gave it a boost
8 time boost by the looks of it
Jiren was able to ignore attacks from SSBE, SSBKKx20, and 17. Since 17 is only SSB level, the team should be 2.05 times stronger than SSBE Vegeta. To ignore attacks from another person completely in DB, he is stated to need 2x the PL. So lowball and take Jiren as 4.1 times stronger than SSBE. MUI outclassed Jiren and LB closed the gap so consider it 2x stronger than normal Jiren. 4.1 x 2= 8.2.
I'm sure he's capable of much more and my personal opinion is much higher, but if it's okay to lowball Saitama so much to continental level+. Then, it's okay to lowball Jiren to 8.2x stronger than SSBE.
So yeah, SSBEKKx20 stomps. That or unknown.
Jiren would probably win. Bolstering stats isn't all it takes, because Jiren can just do that too.
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Source: https://comicvine.gamespot.com/forums/battles-7/vegeta-ssj-blue-evolution-kaio-ken-x20-vs-jiren-fu-2009036/
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